Path: chuka.playstation.co.uk!news From: "Steve Dunn" Newsgroups: scea.yaroze.programming.gnu_compiler Subject: Re: THE YAROZE DEVELOPMENT CD HAS BEEN PIRATED!!! Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 19:16:16 -0000 Organization: PlayStation Net Yaroze (SCEE) Lines: 135 Message-ID: <6ccnkt$beo32@chuka.playstation.co.uk> References: <34DCAAFE.4D1F7640@virgin.net> <6bvqds$bej13@chuka.playstation.co.uk> <34E51258.9588D285@virgin.net> <6c8uar$beo11@chuka.playstation.co.uk> <33558dbd.2646443@news.scea.sony.com> <6c9vgg$beo19@chuka.playstation.co.uk> <34e89573.8820675@www-s.playstation.co.uk> <6cbl4d$beo30@chuka.playstation.co.uk> <34e96f89.551809@www-s.playstation.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: userk760.uk.uudial.com X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Hi again, I'll take your advise from later in this post, and stop winging ! I've got much better things to do, like sit there and wonder why CodeWarrior has crashed again ! (Oops, winging again). > >OK, I take your point in that we compete with the official tools, for >example in the N64 market. However, I like to distinguish between our >efforts and Datel's. I wish I could amplify on why. > I'm not 'up' on the Datels box, but I understand your concern with the rather misplaced high opinion of these 'hacker boxes'. > >>and on the other hand, I didn't learn to drive because some day I wanted to >>drive to Scotland, I just wanted to drive. > >Fair point, but Sony is the rental company too :) > Hello, I'd like to rent a car to drive to Scotland. Have you driven to Scotland sucessfully before ? No, but I've driven to places of a similar distance. Oh I'm sorry, we can't lend you a car, but for a reduced price you can have this push-bike. It's only got one pedal, but if you push hard enough on the pedal that's there we're sure you'll get far enough to find the other pedal. ;) > >I just can't see any difference between the poor quality of the Yaroze >system and the poor quality of systems on home computers from history. >The fact that the Spectrum had no documentation about machine-code >programming or how the ROM worked didn't stop hobbyists from >disseminating it or experts from writing books about it. The one-stop >definitive documentation for the BBC Micro, the Advanced User Guide, >was written by three students from Cambridge or something like that. >If you want something done, do it yourself. Toby said approximately >what I wanted to say (but bottled out of saying) in his message above: >stop whinging - not specifically you personally - and start banging >your head against the right walls. Absence of docs doesn't appear to >have stopped the Japanese Yaroze owners from pissing all over >published games. > History being the key word here. I'm not comparing state of the art consoles with the basic systems of the past. I'm comparing the state of the are consoles with the state of the art development tools 'available' (from SN Systems, tel. 01xxxxx ;) ). I was a BBC freak. I loved it to bits. Acorn didn't impede anyone who wanted to program for it. The Commodore 64 was also great. I was proud to be one of the few and first people to master the "$314" vysnc interupt for sprite multiplexers (although I never got the hang of finding the right amount of NOPS for the hysnc). Back then, the only documentation available was a memory map, and volunteer tutorials on Compunet (Anyone remember the truly superb "Chromas 6502 Assembly Course"? I'm open to contribution payments if you went on to bigger and better things !) My compilations were taking over 40 minutes on the C64. When PD Systems released their C64/Spectrum PDS dev kit for the PC, I was 'the first' person at their door. It was tremendous. That didn't mean I had an advantage over anyone. It just showed my willingness to buy proper tools to do a proper job, something that sadly is no longer the case ;( Anyway, nuff said. I'm off to bash my reset button every 2 minutes after downloading from code warrior, and practice my beard growing technique whilst waiting for the stuff to download in the first place ! ;) P.S. Gil, I hope we're still friends ! (oh, and can you still inform me when you've built the latest GNU:) ) Regards to everyone Steve Dunn >On Tue, 17 Feb 1998 09:27:11 -0000, "Steve Dunn" > wrote: >> Safer yes, but I have to disagree(even though you're kind enough to help >>me with my GNU probs, sorry mate!). The alternative you spoke of is >>currently available, but I doubt anyone would risk their publishing >>liscence to save a few (or more than few) pounds on hacked hardware. If >>they do and they're caught, they're punished. That's the way of the world, >>and it serves them right. Anything and everything is 'copyable'. > >You're wrong... but I can't elaborate without getting into trouble! >Sorry. Suffice to say that it directly helps Sony that their pro >hardware is so complex. > >>A 'PSX Developer' should have the opportunity of spending as much money as >>he/she desires on any tool/kit that they see fit (I'm sure SN Systems are >>behind me on this one). > >Why would we be? We only get royalties from the official Sony devkits >:=) > >OK, I take your point in that we compete with the official tools, for >example in the N64 market. However, I like to distinguish between our >efforts and Datel's. I wish I could amplify on why. > >>and on the other hand, I didn't learn to drive because some day I wanted to >>drive to Scotland, I just wanted to drive. > >Fair point, but Sony is the rental company too :) > >>Now, I'm personally frustrated (although I'm persevering, as you're all >>quite right, it IS the closest I'm going to get to console programming), as >>I am more than competant with the programming side, but feel rather >>restricted by the deliberate limitations of the system. > >I just can't see any difference between the poor quality of the Yaroze >system and the poor quality of systems on home computers from history. >The fact that the Spectrum had no documentation about machine-code >programming or how the ROM worked didn't stop hobbyists from >disseminating it or experts from writing books about it. The one-stop >definitive documentation for the BBC Micro, the Advanced User Guide, >was written by three students from Cambridge or something like that. >If you want something done, do it yourself. Toby said approximately >what I wanted to say (but bottled out of saying) in his message above: >stop whinging - not specifically you personally - and start banging >your head against the right walls. Absence of docs doesn't appear to >have stopped the Japanese Yaroze owners from pissing all over >published games. > > >Gil Jaysmith, SN Systems >---- >The contents of my messages are not to be confused with >SN Systems' official positions or beliefs.